Adsense

Monday, February 21, 2011

Lies Repeated Enough Become True

In an article on the Freedom From Religion Foundation’s work to stop prayer being broadcast over loudspeakers at a Tennessee high school’s football games, a parent responds in defense of the practice:

But parent Jim Rogers, whose son Jason is manager of the football team at East Hamilton School, said he believes public Christian prayer falls under his free speech rights.

“Our country was founded on the principle of religious suffrage and the freedom to express that religion. They incorporated God into our money, the oath of office, our legal system, the Pledge of Allegiance. You cannot find one aspect of our secular government that doesn’t make reference to our creator,” he said.
“Founded on.” In deference to Inigo Montoya, “I don’t think that word means what you think it means.”

The founders did not incorporate god in our money. The first appearance of “In God We Trust” is 1861. It got there by the act of Salmon P. Chase, Secretary of the Treasury, founder of nothing.

The national motto was changed from E Pluribus Unum (From many, One) to “In God We Trust” in the mid 1950’s as a part of the “Red Scare” response to “godless Communism” that also injected “Under God” into the Pledge of Allegiance.

So Help Me God is not an official part of the Presidential Oath of Office.

It is one thing to argue from facts, and another to argue from ignorant beliefs that have been foisted on you by people with an agenda.  All you have to do is repeat a lie often enough and it becomes truth, and the incremental precedents set in all of these small cases, build up to a group of brainwashed Christians actively seeking to designate America a Christian Nation.

Alternatively, you could do a little fact checking and find truth of another person's assertions, rather than simply repeating falsehoods that support the position you wish were true.

Here's what this really is: Another attempt by the fundamental Christians to shove their beliefs in everybody's face, and then when they are asked to stop, claim they are being suppressed. Classic.

When the supreme court rules that “ceremonial deism” or “God inserted to the pledge” is done primarily for secular reasons and has little or no effect on the establishment of religion, I would argue:  Incremental rulings and insertions of God into the secular public square prop up the lunacy and fallacious arguments of people like parent Jim Rogers.

37 comments:

  1. Sure, praying falls under your free speech. But you can't turn around and then claim that other people's free speech isn't allowed. How is forcing prayers onto somebody else free speech in any way, shape or form?

    ReplyDelete
  2. btw, nobody is preventing people at the high school football games from praying. Since it is payed for by the government, the school officials aren't allowed to lead the school in prayer. The students can pray, the audience can pray, even the couches can pray as long as they aren't wasting time or leading the team in prayer.

    ReplyDelete
  3. you made some great points here man, especially about the incorporation of "god" into money and the national motto... too bad that no matter how well you argue your point, people like jimmy rogers will never understand

    ReplyDelete
  4. Didn't know that they added God and such into the currency as well as the Pledge of Allegiance. I'm not from America so I thought it was always there.

    ReplyDelete
  5. That argument is so fucking tired. It honestly takes a 10 minute google search or a tiny little historical perspective to prove that christianity is not what the founders wanted to dominate our government.

    I'm not a rabid anti-religion atheist. I understand some people need religion to fill the vast voids in their education and logic. The line draws when you force me to be a part of it. If I am watching a football game why should I have be uncomfortable and place a target it on myself because I am not praying? Its not church.

    /rage

    ReplyDelete
  6. parent Jim Rogers sounds so stupid

    ReplyDelete
  7. lol @ this country was founded on religious suffrage and freedom to express that religion

    white men who founded this country came here and forced their customs on the natives and told them their customs were too primitive

    what a joke

    ReplyDelete
  8. It really sounds like you're just using wikipedia to discover facts that he HAPPENED to be wrong about. Do you honestly think that many people know the exact date and reason "In God we Trust" became part of our money? No. Tell me, is the prayer really HARMING anyone in any way? If you can prove that, then sure, but otherwise it just seems you're being overly biased. Prayer over an intercom during a game sounds a little weird, I'll be honest, but it CAN'T be utterly detrimental to anything.

    ~Alex
    Good article btw, interesting read! :)

    ReplyDelete
  9. Just another example of how religion is forced into every aspect of our lives.

    ReplyDelete
  10. Agreed, people still don't know the meaning between separation of church and state

    blundersfrom6foot2.blogspot.com

    ReplyDelete
  11. It's sad that people can get so obsessed over religion as to impede on the freedoms of others.

    ReplyDelete
  12. If they perform a Christian prayer, they should also perform a prayer or meditation for every religion present in America and then an atheist statement.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Religion should have nothing to do with football games or any other sport whether you believe in it or not. "God(s)" of any religion doesn't care about your sports game.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Unfortunately, my girlfriend is from Chattanooga, TN, 10 minutes from that school. People there have been trying to get prayer in schools to be mandatory for years so the community isn't likely to give this up without a fight, even if the school system decides to have it removed.

    Also I doubt Mr. Rogers there would be very happy if the football team joined in an Islamic prayer before games. He'd go on preaching about how "this is a Christian nation" and the school is "oppressing his rights" or some shit. Same goes for any religion that isn't Christianity. It's a retarded double standard, really.

    ReplyDelete
  15. well it is a known fact that god always is on the winning side. thats why players thank him so much because god hates losers.

    ReplyDelete
  16. As long as you aren't brainwashing people, you can pray whenever you want for all I care...

    ReplyDelete
  17. Didn't you know, God is a big sports fan and attends all your child's games! Even if you are to lazy of a fat slob to get there your self, you can still pray for you child! God would much rather help your son score that touchdown then help cure AIDS in Africa.

    ReplyDelete
  18. I agree with Banacek. It makes sense.

    ReplyDelete
  19. I am SO sick of people trying to cram their beliefs down my throat, and then claiming freedom of speech, and then, when I share my beliefs they get offended and tell me how un-American I am. Blah, blah, blah.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Students should absolutely have the right to hold true to their spiritual beliefs, but the SECOND any religious faction gains institutional control, we've crossed a line that takes us into Iran territory....great story man!

    ReplyDelete
  21. "we hold these truths to be self-evident," lol.

    Repetition = Fact in the eyes of Christianity.

    ReplyDelete
  22. This example doesn't mean that all Christians are dumbasses and take their god for granted, but dumbasses have an easier time picking up religions.

    Easy Cooking blog:
    http://theproatcooking.blogspot.com/

    ReplyDelete
  23. No one is forcing anyone to pray. So how is this forcing religion down people's throats? With that being said, however, I find it ridiculous that anyone would pray for a high school football game.

    http://robertfunf.blogspot.com/

    ReplyDelete
  24. no comment....this shit just...no comment

    ReplyDelete
  25. im gonna agree with major.mack here..

    ReplyDelete
  26. So much truth in here, it's almost gospel.

    ReplyDelete
  27. i've never seen anything wrong with faith in schools actually, im not that much of a religious person but i think its never bad to base your actions in something thats supposed to be good

    ReplyDelete
  28. Spelling errors happen sometimes, but thanks for pointing it out, just proves I need to proof read more.

    ReplyDelete
  29. http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/fq085/in_a_blatant_attempt_to_defame_talkatheistorg/

    ReplyDelete
  30. @Robert Fünf a publically funded institute cannot favor an established religion. It is against the Establishment clause of the constitution. Furthermore, a prayer over the loudspeaker is meant to represent everyone, and everyone is to be included in such a thing. How would Christians feel if before every football game they went on the loudspeaker and said that there is no God and the only ones responsible for winning or loser are the players themselves because God isn't there to help anyone.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Speaking of lying: http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/fq085/in_a_blatant_attempt_to_defame_talkatheistorg/

    ReplyDelete
  32. they should broadcast prayer at the games. From religions of everyone in attendance, be it jewish, muslim, hindi,paganism, the works. or is it only free speech for christianity?

    randomramblingggg.blogspot.com

    ReplyDelete
  33. http://thetechcraze.blogspot.com

    ReplyDelete